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One of BBC’s top 100 Women in foul-mouthed attack on insideMAN

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A high profile feminist campaigner has launched a foul-mouthed attack on insideMAN magazine. If you don’t want to read an article full of swearing, please stop reading now!

This week, on International Men’s Day (Wednesday 19th November) we received an email from feminist comedian and activist, Kate Smurthwaite, which opened as follows:

“Would you please tell whoever wrote this utter shit to go fuck themselves?”

If you don’t know who Kate Smurthwaite is, in 2013 she was chosen by the BBC as one of its list of “100 Women” from around the world who “campaign for their causes and strive for a better world”, alongside the former New Zealand Prime Minister, Helen Clark; the winner of 11 paralympian gold medals, Tanni Grey-Thompson and the barrister and philanthropist, Cherie Blair.

As a comedian and political commentator, she makes regular appearances on TV and radio (including Question Time) and has links with a broad range of organisations such as the NUT (National Union of Teachers); Abortion Rights UK and the London Feminist Network.

Smurthwaite was emailing us in response to a press release we sent to journalists and commentators,  promoting some of the  articles from our #100Voices4Men an Boys series.

Four reasons feminism is alienating men and boys 

In particular, we highlighted an article by Duncan Fisher, a former commissioner at the Equal Opportunities Commission who ran a small focus group with teenage boys and then wrote about the experience here: “Four reasons feminism is alienating teenage boys”. He said:

“We will never end sexism and gender inequality without the help of boys and men – this has always been the case and will always be. Wagging the finger at all young men and saying “repent!” is an incredibly ineffective recruitment strategy and alienates the men and boys equality work most needs”.

Fisher is not a lone voice expressing such concerns about the current hostility found in the feminist discourse on gender issues. On the day before International Men’s Day, the feminist campaigner and journalist, Julie Bindel, wrote an article in The Guardian saying that “feminism is in danger of becoming toxic”.

Abusive feminists deny women decent male allies 

The previous week, Jake Wallis Simons at Telegraph Men, made a similar point in his comment piece “the internet hates men and no-one’s a winner“:

“Misogynist trolling by horrid little men is a huge concern, but the answer is not to alienate the rest of us…In the current climate of febrile abusiveness…the more the anti-men trend gains traction, the more women will be deprived of decent male allies.”

Fisher’s thoughtful article listing four key reasons why feminism is alienating young men did not impress Smurthwaite.

Feminism wants you to fuck off 

Here’s Kate Smurthwaite’s email to insideMAN in full:

“Would you please tell whoever wrote this utter shit to go fuck themselves?

“It is not the job of women to make men feel welcome in feminism. Men shouldn’t be in favour of female equality because women were nice to them and/or made them feel at ease and comfortable and not too threatened.

“Feminism is about women’s rights. RIGHTS. Rights are things we should just get. Not have to fight for, not have to “play nice” for, not have to decide carefully on how best to ask for. We should just get them cos they’re rights.

“And feminism is the same thing as gender equality. Those who say it is not are lying assholes trying to divide and destroy the movement.

“Please let them know they are misogynist dickwads and that feminism doesn’t want their help. Feminism wants them to fuck off and leave us the fuck alone.”

Free speech doesn’t mean telling people to fuck off

As Fisher wrote in his article for insideMAN: “Social media spreads outrageous views far faster than reasoned arguments and the social media these boys see every day is awash with fundamentalist views that brook no contradiction. The answer: keep a low profile. If you are targeted on-line, everyone can see. The same goes for large numbers of thoughtful teenage girls who would get fired at just as quickly.”

Smurthwaite is an advocate of a certain kind of “free speech”. In 2012 she told the One Law for All London Rally for Free Expression:

“If there is one thing more frightening to fundamentalists than someone with a well-formed opinion, it is someone with a well-formed opinion and a vagina.”

http://youtu.be/YaJQN66L4Tw

Freedom of speech is not simply about rights, it’s also about culture, psychology and behaviour. One of the reasons we launched the #100Voices4Men is that men and boys (and non-feminists generally) don’t experience a culture of free speech when it comes to gender issues.

Conversations about men and masculinity are being oppressed 

One of our writers described what he sees as a “pervasive drive to limit the discussion of men and masculinity to a single, poisonous, narrative: men don’t have problems, they cause them.” We took the considered step of allowing him to post under a pen name, because he was psychologically afraid of what might happen at his public sector workplace if colleagues read the article.

Of course he has the right to say what he wants—anyone has the right to put up a blog or post their views on social media, as long as they’re not libeling people, threatening people or inciting hatred.

But having a right to free speech, but being scared to speak up because your viewpoint is culturally unacceptable to certain controlling interests, who are prepared to behave in a hostile and abusive way towards you if you speak out—is not free speech in action.

Being heard is a two-way process 

A culture of free speech requires free listening—that’s listening free from judgment, anger, hatred, blame and an oppressive desire to close down anyone who thinks differently to you to “go an fuck themselves”. Listening without judgment doesn’t mean agreeing with everything other people say, it means setting aside your own prejudices and judgments for long enough to actually hear what other people have to say.

As I wrote in the article that launched the #100Voices4Men series on 1st October:

“Being heard is a two-way process, it involves speaking and listening—and for too long men and boys have either not spoken up about their experiences of being male, or have not been listened to when they do speak out.

“Our #100Voices4Men and Boys project is a small but significant step towards giving men and boys in the UK a bigger voice in conversations about gender. We can’t promise to agree with everything you say, but we do promise we’ll listen.”

As promised, I’ve listened to what Kate Smurthwaite, one of the BBC’s 100 Women of 2013, had to say to us here at insideMAN magazine and have come  to the conclusion that she is right about one thing, there is nothing more frightening to a fundamentalist than someone with a well-formed opinion.

The world needs fewer fundamentalists and more men and women with well formed opinions who are prepared to support free speech with free listening—and it’s hard to listen to anyone or anything when you’re telling them they are a “misogynist dickwad” who should go and “fuck themselves”.

Article by Glen Poole author of the book Equality For Men

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Also on insideMAN:
  • Paul Mills

    This kind of behaviour, especially by high profile people who claim to be seeking sex equality is just why so many people are feeling feminism has lost it’s way and needs to take a fresh look at what is really going on in the world. You are right about fundamentalism…… which of course by it’s very nature prevents free use of the individuals rights. By the way , we do need to remember that with every right there comes a responsibility to use it with discression and with respect to the other!

    Maybe of course we are missing the point. Kate is a comedian, and simply plying her trade and the mistake is to take her words seriously. If indeed she is trying to be serious Isuggest she could learn a lot from my 8 year old son.

    • Inside MAN

      All I’ll say is imagine a male comedian writing something similar to a female journalist?

  • Darren Ball

    Very disappointing this from Kate. She doesn’t need to stoop to abusive language as she is, in fact, extremely intelligent.

    Duncan’s article was my favourite and was completely fair and balanced. He discusses gendered problems faced by women and girls (including his own daughter), and he goes on to discuss some gendered issues faced by men: in particular the problem that we’re not allowed to speak our minds without being verbally assaulted. This is true no matter how well-intentioned, accurate and balanced we are. Nothing but complete submission to mainstream feminist orthodoxy will do. This seemed to me to be the main thread of Duncan’s article.

    Then right on cue, and with no obvious sense of irony, a feminists says: go fuck yourself, lying asshole, misogynist dickwad.

    How exactly does that disprove Duncan’s article?

    Very disappointing!

  • http://antmcewanreport.blogspot.co.uk Ant McEwan

    Let’s all give Kate Smurthwaite an award. What a brilliant woman and true representation of feminism she really is! And such a talented comedian!

    That was sarcasm by the way. If she was to receive an award, in terms she would understand, it would be the award for World’s Most Stupid ******!

    And for her to so sadly misrepresent her own cause, turn a fleet of men and boys against her by use of her own words, and in general demean and put down another cause which, in general terms shines light on equal factors effecting men as it may effect women, is absolutely ridiculous!

    However, if we look at it from the perspective that this was a comedy piece, designed to make people laugh, and to garner a reaction as such, whether good or bad, then she has succeeded. Except now everyone who reads her words here will doubtless laugh in her face whenever they cross her path in the street.

    God, I hope they do. Although, don’t get too close folks, personal space and all that. Plus if you’re a male, she might think you’re a potential rapist!

    Anyway, thanks for bringing light to this, and for making me aware who Kate Smurthwaite is. I’m sure she’ll just love the publicity, as previously no one knew or cared for her existence anyway! [Edited to keep in line with comments policy]

  • Karen Woodall

    This makes me smile. Feminism is not your ally, it does not welcome you, it has no space for you and pandering to it and appeasing it is not going to change the world (and let’s face it there are plenty of men who have made a buck or two pandering to it and plenty who still do). Kate is tellling you like it is – feminism is about WOMEN’S RIGHTS – not yours, not boys, not men, not equality – WOMEN and it will fight unto death to ensure that those rights come first last and always – which is why talking about equality and expecting feminists to welcome you in is a bit daft really.

    These women are ferocious – you’ve got off lightly in my view.

    • Christopher Wedge

      Not men, boys, or even girls. Well, girls sometimes, if it hurts boys. It’s about women, and them being allowed to do whatever they want.

  • Karen Woodall

    And using Duncan Fisher as an example of how much you are into equalities won’t cut the mustard either I’m afraid – there is one thing these women hate more than men and that is a man who says he is into equalities. No way round it you see – if you are a man you are NEVER going to be welcomed into the hallowed spaces of these halls. I am afraid there is no way of reasoning your way through this, this is beyond reason, this is the la la world of feminism and feminist activitists – watch and learn boys, watch and learn ?

  • Duncan

    Yesterday I ran a workshop for new dads in a large company. A young dad told me his story of how he had had to push really hard – to the point of threatening legal action – to get the same flexible working arrangements as female colleagues, so that he could look after his child and let his partner work and pursue her career. He stands in a long line of people who have challenged working culture, mostly women in the past, but now men too. THAT is real campaigning for gender inequality: chipping away and taking real personal risks. It also shows how women and men are right now working with and for each other for equality. I am shocked at what Kate Smurthwaite wrote – she is terribly wrong, but she does not represent the views of many other feminists and returning fire with similar abuse, as has already happened in one comment above (I think it should be deleted), is simply an extension of a behaviour that I detest. The teenagers made a point, it has been proved right. The next word belongs to teenagers.

    • Janet

      I don’t agree, I think she is very representative of feminism as a whole. Modern day feminism has become exactly what she portrays it to be, a bile spewing hateful and divisive movement.

      Feminism has always been like that deep down, you soon see that side as soon as you start to challenge them on a topic. They soon show their sexist colours and it becomes obvious they are deeply sexist and are suffering from mental health issues.

  • paul

    I’m not shocked or surprised…whatever other public faces this woman has and however she might be received and perceived in other circles; here in this context she is being abusive. We should send her flowers and a get well soon note…and the more sincere and mature feminists might want to educate her around some of the more fundamental principles of what being an adult human entails; whatever her gender agenda…she’s made herself, her cause and her community look very very stupid. [Edited to keep in line with comments policy]

  • Karen Woodall

    The next world might belong to teenagers but those teenagers are growing up silenced if they are not female and those teenagers are growing up to learn that being a man is about doing what women tell them to do. Feminism has caused that and Kate is nothing more than representative of feminism and believing that not all feminists are like that is simply ridiculous. It makes me smile when people are shocked or even surprised by what this woman has written, what world do you live in? Feminism is about women’s rights, it has got nothing to do with equality, it is about imposing the rights of women first and everyone else second, she is simply telling you like it is. Floundering around saying that she is not representative of feminism or not all feminists are like that is just avoiding reality and trying to hang on to the idea that feminism is about nice people as well – it’s not – it is about people who believe that men are privileged, powerful and predatory. Get real, if you want the teenager boys of the next world to actually have a voice never mind equality, stop pandering to these people and say it like it actually is. Kate is.

  • Stu

    KAREN WOODALL. You are 100% correct. Unfortunately most men will eat a bucket full of dogs defecation rather then risk losing the approval of women and their “good men” card by rejecting and calling out feminism for what it really is.

  • Karen Woodall

    And I am interested in why that is Stu because it seems to me that it is that terror in men, which I am ashamed to say I was part of in a past (young) life that has created this horrible out of balance society that we live in. I am ashamed of my younger days and I am not ashamed to admit that today. When I look back at the eighties we young feminists behaved appallingly towards young men at times, we shamed them, we humiliated them and we made ourselves feel good about ourselves because of that. Second wave feminism told us we had been oppressed and those of us who had had difficult relationships with men as our fathers or grandfathers fell for the doctrine that all men are like that – and found solace and revenge in feminism as a result. What I see now is a repeat of that behaviour, Kate for example, is only doing what I expect feminists to do. But there appears to be another belief about feminism that runs alongside what I know about feminism, which is that a ‘good feminist’ isn’t like Kate. This is a false belief because in the world of feminism, the only good feminist is one who acts on her sisters behalf and who upholds the core beliefs of feminism – which is that all men are privileged, powerful and predatory. So where does this idea that feminism is really a benign and beautiful belief system that brings about a better world come from? Could it be that it comes from people who really believe in equality but don’t want to be seen to attack feminism because of the fear of what feminists will do to them? Could it come from men who really want to be fighting for the rights of men and boys but who are scared of what that makes them in the eyes of others? Is there a massive cohort of people who have been brainwashed to believe that feminism is really about nice men and women working together for equality? I think there must be. I think Kate has other ideas myself.

  • Bones

    Hi. I’m new today to writing anything, anywhere on the web. It seems to me that ‘feminism’, the word, is in play. Tussles over language help illuminate the issues but if a definition is in dispute then the using word itself becomes inefficient. Defining ‘Feminism for what it really is’ and ‘Feminism is about …’ can’t be done in this type of forum. IMHO: the damage done by gender conflict hurts in all directions; let’s help boys, male-teens and men be strong & let’s help girls, female-teens and women be strong too.

  • Bones

    Minor edit to above: Hi. I’m new today to writing anything, anywhere on the web. It seems to me that ‘feminism’, the word, is in play. Tussles over language help illuminate the issues but if a definition is in dispute then using the word itself becomes inefficient. Defining ‘Feminism for what it really is’ and ‘Feminism is about …’ can’t be done in this type of forum. IMHO: the damage done by gender conflict hurts in all directions; let’s help boys, male-teens and men be strong & let’s help girls, female-teens and women be strong too.

  • John Rew

    I bathe in feminists tears.

  • malcolm

    We should thank Ms. Smurthwaite for being yet another shining example why men (and women) should no longer patronize feminists and take them seriously. It’s quite clear that feminism traps women in childhood and appeals to that “it’s not fair” mentality that we stop tolerating in children beyond the age of six.

  • Karen Woodall

    Great analysis Malcolm, my feeling (and experience) exactly.

  • Trevour

    Feminism hasn’t changed it’s tune in over a century. It has added to the melody. But in general, it’s about privileged women and men, telling everybody else how to live their lives. They have immense political clout. It’s most important to push back against feminism in a calm and reasonable manner. It’s in your schools, place of work and your laws. It’s chivalric ways are in the mindset of many unaware people. Use you discretion at all times and take back your power.

  • ChinoGambino

    Kate Smurthwaite is just hurt her sacred cow is under scrutiny, doesn’t matter how slight its an affront to her identity. It smacks of bigotry and entitlement. Now let’s see.

    “Would you please tell whoever wrote this utter shit to go fuck themselves?”

    Would you give us a reason to bother? No, having a vagina isn’t a reason respect someone.

    “It is not the job of women to make men feel welcome in feminism. Men shouldn’t be in favour of female equality because women were nice to them and/or made them feel at ease and comfortable and not too threatened.”

    The men didn’t express any opposition to equality, just feminism. Apart from the dishonest conflation and the strawman implicit here, feminists are a political group like any other capable of alienating like minded people. Oh and sorry feminists, your ideas are can be threatening in a sense for good reasons, I find Sharia threatening; that doesn’t mean its advocates are right.

    “Feminism is about women’s rights. RIGHTS. Rights are things we should just get. Not have to fight for, not have to “play nice” for, not have to decide carefully on how best to ask for. We should just get them cos they’re rights.

    “And feminism is the same thing as gender equality. Those who say it is not are lying assholes trying to divide and destroy the movement.

    Depends what you mean by gender equality. France seems to think making paternity tests illegal is equality. I would hazard most feminists couldn’t care less about infant male genital mutilation despite having ample power to affect change where they live. it’s conspicuous absence from the discourse and outright hostility when it is mentioned is not gender equality to anyone with principle.

    “Please let them know they are misogynist dickwads and that feminism doesn’t want their help. Feminism wants them to fuck off and leave us the fuck alone.”

    Irrational bigotry from a fake secularist. Feminism isn’t an agent, nor is it a unified movement that can be spoken for by a barely literate mouth-breather. We never came to you, your kind came to recruit us you entitled princess.

  • Reason

    Clearly, feminism is not misandry. It’s insanity.

  • Nigel

    Feminism. Well my take on it is a heresy of Marxism set off by Engels. But in truth feminism is what self proclaimed feminists do. As Julie Bindel points out what they do is ” becoming toxic and repressive” .  Still in a sort of denial about the fact that it’s proponents are now ” the establishment” feminists are privileged and powerful and use that power to reprise McCarthyism. 
    I note that the vitriol was aimed at the mildest of critical pieces. 

  • karen Woodall

    and the reason the vitriol was aimed at the mildest piece is this. Feminists do not want men involved in equalities, they especially do not want men involved in feminism (despite their claim to want men to be feminists and boys to be taught feminist doctrine). They don’t want men involved because they do not wish to share the power that they have obtained and that they maintain OVER others. When they say they want men to be feminists they mean they want men to be grateful to be allowed in and they want boys to be made to feel grateful that they can transformed into acceptable people by becoming feminists. When men attempt to enter the feminist debate as equals they are absolutely damned for their arrogance (how dare they attempt to tell women how to do something, how to feel something, how to be) and this leads to the kind of reaction that you see in Kate. The only way men are welcome in feminism is as subjects, subjugated and suffered but accepted because they have shown sufficient supplication. You may consider the piece mild but in feminist terms it is absolute heresay and it’s author should be condemned forever for being arrogant enough to think he actually has something sensible to say. Which is ironic given the defence of feminism the author makes in the comment above. I don’t understand why more people do not ‘get’ how feminism really works and I can only conclude that this is because the masses have been brainwashed into believing it is a benign movement about equality, it isn’t, it never was, it is about womenand their rights, first last and always and it has nothing whatsoever to do with men and boys wellbeing or equality and the sooner people understand how the land lies the better we will be able to transform that land for the wellbeing of men and most of all for boys for whom the future looks bleak indeed.

  • karen Woodall

    with apologies for appalling grammar in the comment above!

  • http://mscarol420.tumblr.com/ MsCarol420

    I agree withg Karen Woodall’s opinion of feminism and I also remember the feminist movement of the 1970’s. While I appreciated women’s liberation and supported the movement in the early ’60’s I disagreed with the foul mouthed women who began ranting about social issues, the patriarchy, sexism, and the victimization of women.

    I lived as an equal to men in that I worked where I wanted to work and was able to do anything I set my mind to. I never felt victimized in any way and when men yelled “It must be jelly because jam don’t shake!” as I walked by I never felt fearful, if I didn’t like it I was capable of telling them to “Fuck off!” if I felt like it. Most often I simply continued to walk with purpose to my destination.

    While feminists are quick to cite the dictionary definition of feminism and agree they want equality their actions reveal their true purpose of revenge on the patriarchy. They object to everything men enjoy and resent the presence of men in their world to the point of penalizing boys by favoriting girls in the classroom and ignoring boys. I have sons, grandsons, and great grandsons and I do not want my little boys to grow up without an education and learn to fear even looking at a girl. This is the feminist road and it is a dead end for men.

    I never heard of this comedian but her response to Inside Man is typical for feminists and one more reason to dislike them. They are simply unpleasant to talk with and do not tolerate anyone who has an opinion that differs from theirs. They ignore facts and fail to use logic in argument. I find it ironic they complain about inequality while telling me to stick it where the sun won’t rise. Online they tell me I’m a man because that it the worst insult they can give. They are a hate group and like the KKK they have the freedom to believe and say whatever they like.

    What bothers me though is their political influence and political power to write law that changes the definition of crime and denies the accused due process. Rape has always been a crime of violence that required force or the threat of force but not anymore. I would be the first to agree that rapists should be punished but not without evidence to supporting the allegation. Rape is a serious felony offense and I hate to see men imprisoned for any reason without evidence to support the charge. Women are just as capable of violence as men and should receive the same sentence as men who are violent. This would be equality.

    I will also say that from reading it appears the UK and Canada are more shackled by feminism than men but the U.S. is on the same road and will be just as rigid and oppressive if we do nothing to detour them.

  • dinkum droob

    You’re all being far too nice about this. Kate Smurthwaite’s email constitues sexual harassment (‘dickwad’ for example) and she should be reported to the police for sexual harassment.